FWIS3

I think some people would prefer to believe ANYTHING other than the reality of the situation: An incredibly stupid, unethical and dangerous man, the entitled and privileged product of unchecked greed and capitalism, has convinced millions of mouthbreathers he is a viable candidate, all the while knocking aside every conceivable precedent for decent and "Presidential" behaviour, and all in the pursuit of his own twisted narcissistic agenda. That wasn't supposed to happen in the enlightened beacon of democracy right?

squ1d wrote:I think some people would prefer to believe ANYTHING other than the reality of the situation: An incredibly stupid, unethical and dangerous man, the entitled and privileged product of unchecked greed and capitalism, has convinced millions of mouthbreathers he is a viable candidate, all the while knocking aside every conceivable precedent for decent and "Presidential" behaviour, and all in the pursuit of his own twisted narcissistic agenda. That wasn't supposed to happen in the enlightened beacon of democracy right?

And he's orange, with fake hair! If someone wrote a movie with this plot, before this happened, we all would have sneered at it! I can't seem to stop writing sentences that end with exclamation points!

SciFi Chick wrote:

squ1d wrote:I think some people would prefer to believe ANYTHING other than the reality of the situation: An incredibly stupid, unethical and dangerous man, the entitled and privileged product of unchecked greed and capitalism, has convinced millions of mouthbreathers he is a viable candidate, all the while knocking aside every conceivable precedent for decent and "Presidential" behaviour, and all in the pursuit of his own twisted narcissistic agenda. That wasn't supposed to happen in the enlightened beacon of democracy right?

And he's orange, with fake hair! If someone wrote a movie with this plot, before this happened, we all would have sneered at it! I can't seem to stop writing sentences that end with exclamation points!

Hell, Hollywood would only have considered it if it were a comedy. They would never have tried to produce a serious movie that mirrored this reality.

squ1d wrote:I think some people would prefer to believe ANYTHING other than the reality of the situation: An incredibly stupid, unethical and dangerous man, the entitled and privileged product of unchecked greed and capitalism, has convinced millions of mouthbreathers he is a viable candidate, all the while knocking aside every conceivable precedent for decent and "Presidential" behaviour, and all in the pursuit of his own twisted narcissistic agenda. That wasn't supposed to happen in the enlightened beacon of democracy right?

Good summary squid.

The US is an "enlightened beacon of democracy" only in our own minds ("our own" is used collectively for the nation, and does not include particular individuals).

As I think I said earlier, I think the trick is most folks forget that the point of fascism is it always adapts to the nationality it's in. Trump is pretty much exactly what I'd expect for the American version of it.

I said earlier btw that I thought the only exception was I was expecting a bigger religious component, but then if you think about it it's not like Hitler was religious, but he did get the approval of the religious leaders at the time. And he does appear to have that from the evangelical movement, which is crazy in many senses when you stop and consider how non-Christian the guy really is. Guess they really hate the Clintons, I don't know.

Swift wrote:Good summary squid.

The US is an "enlightened beacon of democracy" only in our own minds ("our own" is used collectively for the nation, and does not include particular individuals).

Take it from me, it could me much much much worse

Rommie wrote:As I think I said earlier, I think the trick is most folks forget that the point of fascism is it always adapts to the nationality it's in. Trump is pretty much exactly what I'd expect for the American version of it.

I said earlier btw that I thought the only exception was I was expecting a bigger religious component, but then if you think about it it's not like Hitler was religious, but he did get the approval of the religious leaders at the time. And he does appear to have that from the evangelical movement, which is crazy in many senses when you stop and consider how non-Christian the guy really is. Guess they really hate the Clintons, I don't know.

Or MAYBE they've decided that the only way they're going to get the nation to do their bidding is through Trump (GK, remember what I said about orientation to power? )

Rommie wrote:As I think I said earlier, I think the trick is most folks forget that the point of fascism is it always adapts to the nationality it's in. Trump is pretty much exactly what I'd expect for the American version of it.

I said earlier btw that I thought the only exception was I was expecting a bigger religious component, but then if you think about it it's not like Hitler was religious, but he did get the approval of the religious leaders at the time. And he does appear to have that from the evangelical movement, which is crazy in many senses when you stop and consider how non-Christian the guy really is. Guess they really hate the Clintons, I don't know.

I think Sigma has it.

I think a lot of Evangelicals are focused on one thing - get someone in there who will pick anti-abortion, anti-LGBTQ Supreme Court justices. A president who will rubber stamp a lot of Tea Party agenda items is a bonus. This is entirely about politics, and nothing about morals and religion. They will publicly say that Trump is a good Christian (I've seen them say that exact thing). I don't know if they really believe it (they probably have convinced themselves it is true), but it doesn't matter. Their vote is set.

And no, they are not going to vote for Libertarian Gary Johnson - on social issues most libertarians are worse (as far as they are concerned) than Hillary.

It's interesting actually, as I remember in college when I was a part of the Libertarians club (which was a really fun group of people- I suppose most college political clubs are as you are still so idealistic) then libertarians off campus actually had a serious religious beat. It was basically run by people who are likely now part of the Tea Party movement, but in short they believed that you need minimal government because people are currently looking to government for charity that they should be relying on churches to provide instead. Oh, and curiously a lot of pro-life folks are in the libertarian movement too- I guess if you literally believe a fertilized egg is a life, then the government swooping in to stop someone from murdering you is, in fact, what the government is supposed to do.

I guess you are right though swift (again! ) as you're right, Trump is totally fine appointing super conservative judges' names to make sure those people elect him, and I'm sure they're of the mindset that the ends justify the means. And I think there are likely also a large group of people supporting him on the grounds that they think they'll be able to "control" him- he can't actually build a wall because Congress won't let him, blah blah blah. A common rationalization throughout history!

So btw, because we aren't starting a new thread every time , how 'bout those Russia ties that came out this morning with regards to the campaign? Can't say I'm surprised- I'm sure Trump didn't know, but he's not savvy enough to realize when people were looking to help his campaign they might have ulterior motives of this nature. I suppose I'm mainly interested in the sense that it's really strange to see how long it will be until people forget about this- I know there have been many scandals so far that would've sunk other candidates, but they still fascinate me.

IMO Swift hit it. The conservative Christian groups out there are not so much Pro-Trump as they are Anti-Progressive Liberal causes. They want to roll back LGBT, Pro-Choice, and other progressive issues. They see Trump as supporting their ideology better than Clinton ever would.

And anyone who has been paying attention the last 50 years has realized that judges make a difference. Just look at Proposition 8 in California. If the courts had more conservative judges sitting on them when that case went to the Supremes IMO the outcome would have been very different.

It's somewhat the same for other issues such as jobs and immigration. Although how anyone can believe Trump really has any intention of stopping the manufacturing of goods overseas is beyond me.

In addition to everything else y'all are saying, I can tell you, as someone who grew up on the Evangelical side of things - they will definitely be pushing an anti-Muslim agenda, they'll be enthusiastic about the idea of going to war with ISIS (boots on the ground), and they will expect to win because, of course God will be on their side, especially after they get rid of the "LGBTQ agenda" and abortion.

I mentioned this on Facebook, but some of you aren't on Facebook, so I'll mention it here as well. I think most of you know what a big fan of the Clintons I am. I didn't think anything could convince me to vote for her. I really didn't think it could get this bad. But as long as Trump is in the race, she has my vote. I just thought I'd mention, 'cause I know some of y'all think I'm stubborn enough to elect Hitler.

SciFi Chick wrote:In addition to everything else y'all are saying, I can tell you, as someone who grew up on the Evangelical side of things - they will definitely be pushing an anti-Muslim agenda, they'll be enthusiastic about the idea of going to war with ISIS (boots on the ground), and they will expect to win because, of course God will be on their side, especially after they get rid of the "LGBTQ agenda" and abortion.

I mentioned this on Facebook, but some of you aren't on Facebook, so I'll mention it here as well. I think most of you know what a big fan of the Clintons I am. I didn't think anything could convince me to vote for her. I really didn't think it could get this bad. But as long as Trump is in the race, she has my vote. I just thought I'd mention, 'cause I know some of y'all think I'm stubborn enough to elect Hitler.

Well, if he promised to fix freeway gridlock I might vote for him.

SciFiFisher wrote:

SciFi Chick wrote:In addition to everything else y'all are saying, I can tell you, as someone who grew up on the Evangelical side of things - they will definitely be pushing an anti-Muslim agenda, they'll be enthusiastic about the idea of going to war with ISIS (boots on the ground), and they will expect to win because, of course God will be on their side, especially after they get rid of the "LGBTQ agenda" and abortion.

I mentioned this on Facebook, but some of you aren't on Facebook, so I'll mention it here as well. I think most of you know what a big fan of the Clintons I am. I didn't think anything could convince me to vote for her. I really didn't think it could get this bad. But as long as Trump is in the race, she has my vote. I just thought I'd mention, 'cause I know some of y'all think I'm stubborn enough to elect Hitler.

Well, if he promised to fix freeway gridlock I might vote for him.

I'm sure his fix will involve building a wall. And he'll make the trains pay for it.