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Oklahoma Wesleyan Univ President: 'This Is Not a Daycare'

PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2015 5:53 pm
by Swift
I'm not completely sure if this is politics, but what the heck...

The President of Oklahoma Wesleyan University posted the following on his blog, and it is now making national news:

This past week, I actually had a student come forward after a university chapel service and complain because he felt “victimized” by a sermon on the topic of 1 Corinthians 13. It appears that this young scholar felt offended because a homily on love made him feel bad for not showing love. In his mind, the speaker was wrong for making him, and his peers, feel uncomfortable.

I’m not making this up. Our culture has actually taught our kids to be this self-absorbed and narcissistic. Any time their feelings are hurt, they are the victims. Anyone who dares challenge them and, thus, makes them “feel bad” about themselves, is a “hater,” a “bigot,” an “oppressor,” and a “victimizer.”

I have a message for this young man and all others who care to listen. That feeling of discomfort you have after listening to a sermon is called a conscience. An altar call is supposed to make you feel bad. It is supposed to make you feel guilty. The goal of many a good sermon is to get you to confess your sins—not coddle you in your selfishness. The primary objective of the Church and the Christian faith is your confession, not your self-actualization.

...

Oklahoma Wesleyan is not a “safe place”, but rather, a place to learn: to learn that life isn’t about you, but about others; that the bad feeling you have while listening to a sermon is called guilt; that the way to address it is to repent of everything that’s wrong with you rather than blame others for everything that’s wrong with them. This is a place where you will quickly learn that you need to grow up.

This is not a day care. This is a university!


Link to the blog

NBC article about this

The post, however, wasn't meant to be directed at the student who raised the issue, Piper told NBC News. "This is not a message to my students per se ... This is a message to the broader community."

Piper said he doesn't support "the shouting down of a contrary idea rather than a civil and polite exchange disagreement" because he believes respectful discourse is a foundation of academia.

"A liberal arts academy is about learning. It's not supposed to be a place to suppress controversial ideas," Piper said. My point was to challenge my own industry — to look my academic peers in the eye and say: 'We've caused this.'"

My bold.

And, I think, exactly correct.

Re: Oklahoma Wesleyan Univ President: 'This Is Not a Daycare

PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2015 6:10 pm
by vendic
It's time to sue Jesus!

Re: Oklahoma Wesleyan Univ President: 'This Is Not a Daycare

PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2015 6:44 pm
by brite
YES!!!!!! I think he's spot on!!!! It's not all about these whiny ass children... Life doesn't evolve around them. And the sooner they figure that out... The better off they will be!

Re: Oklahoma Wesleyan Univ President: 'This Is Not a Daycare

PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2015 10:20 pm
by Swift
And let me add a clarification....

I am not flat out against "political correctness"; I actually think it is very important. Words do matter, and what we say to others matters, and hurting other people with words matter. I think it is very important that we (as a society) treat each other better and with respect.

But, like so many good ideas, some people have taken "political correctness" to absurd extremes. For example, it is one thing to prevent grade school kids from using racial slurs or bullying. It is another to so sanitize the college experience that one can't have a meaningful debate about issues of importance.

Re: Oklahoma Wesleyan Univ President: 'This Is Not a Daycare

PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2015 10:21 pm
by Swift
vendic wrote:It's time to sue Jesus!

Forget suing him... nail him to a cross! :twisted:

Re: Oklahoma Wesleyan Univ President: 'This Is Not a Daycare

PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2015 11:43 pm
by vendic
*LIKE!
lol

Re: Oklahoma Wesleyan Univ President: 'This Is Not a Daycare

PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2015 1:34 am
by SciFiFisher
Swift wrote:
vendic wrote:It's time to sue Jesus!

Forget suing him... nail him to a cross! :twisted:


That's so last millennia. Already been there. Done That. :P

I always thought that if you really wanted to make a messiah suffer you should do something more creative like let them live and watch while their followers realized that they were all too human. :lol:

Re: Oklahoma Wesleyan Univ President: 'This Is Not a Daycare

PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2015 2:09 am
by Cyborg Girl
Uh guys, guys? Really?

http://www.okwu.edu/blog/2015/11/dr-pip ... ver-truth/
http://www.okwu.edu/blog/2015/11/ideolo ... l-freedom/

But a final word: There is a solution, and it’s found in the ideas of the historical liberal arts academy and in the Church that founded it; in liberty and liberation; in freedom and justice; in ideas that are self-evident, inalienable and endowed to us by Nature and Nature’s God. They’re the ideas that lead to freedom – freedom that is found not in the hubris of man but rather in the words of Christ: “You shall know the Truth and the Truth shall set you free.”


I agree with the words of Piper's sentiment per Swift's link above, but do we really want to go all the way and agree with the subtext? Really? Because it's pretty clear to me that this is a case of a broken clock being right twice a day.

Edit: seriously though, I agree absolutely with what Piper says about guilt. But from the looks of it, I wouldn't agree with re: what I'm supposed to feel guilty about.

Edit 2: as for the sermon itself, I'd need to see the contents thereof before dismissing the student's complaint.

Edit 3: you know what, Piper can just sod off.

"This has nothing to do about race. This is about the arrogance and the narcissism of our culture," Piper said on "The Pat Campbell Show."


I swear, the words "ivory" and "tower" were invented for this guy.

(Also, just for reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pat_Campb ... dcaster%29 )

Re: Oklahoma Wesleyan Univ President: 'This Is Not a Daycare

PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2015 5:46 am
by vendic
Great chat with yourself GJ! rofl

For the record I do that a lot too.

Re: Oklahoma Wesleyan Univ President: 'This Is Not a Daycare

PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2015 4:13 pm
by Swift
Gullible Jones wrote:I agree with the words of Piper's sentiment per Swift's link above, but do we really want to go all the way and agree with the subtext? Really? Because it's pretty clear to me that this is a case of a broken clock being right twice a day.

Who is agreeing with the "subtext" (and how do you know what his "subtext" was, are you telepathic?)? And who is agreeing with anything else the man said?

I posted one thing that he said that I think was a good point.

Re: Oklahoma Wesleyan Univ President: 'This Is Not a Daycare

PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2015 5:25 pm
by Cyborg Girl
@Swift

It's conservative dog-whistle material, basically. After you see a lot of it, it starts to stand out.

In this case, yes, he's making a legitimate point. The problem IMO is more who he's singling out with it. When you consider that this country has a rather vicious history of oppressing certain groups, what he's saying makes a lot less sense in context. He's taking one possibly-stupid example of someone saying "I'm being oppressed", and tarring lots of people with it, in a way that doesn't really follow.

And no, university is not daycare, and should not be. The thing is, that includes being daycare for people like Piper. IMO a good humanities curriculum is going to make everyone uncomfortable at some point - black, white, liberal, conservative, man, woman, whoever. We've all been complicit in bullshit at some point. Part of the job of college humanities courses is to make that clear, so people change their behavior and won't be complicit the next time.

... Okay okay, I'll step off my soapbox now.