Kobe Bryant's Legacy

[geonuc]

I read an article on the Washington Post about how that paper put one of its reporters on leave, paid leave. She had tweeted something about Kobe Bryant's legacy that few had been mentioning. Namely, his having been charged with sexual assault and having settled a civil suit with his accuser a number of years ago. The tweet created a backlash against her (the reporter) and the paper, so the Post decided to sideline her, and ordered her to delete the tweet, which she did.

What do y'all think about that? For myself, I've avoided publicly expressing anything about Bryant specifically because of the sexual assault charge (which was dismissed when the accuser refused to testify but was clearly a substantial charge based on everything we know). While I'm a big fan of redemption and second chances, it's part of who he was and shouldn't be buried. Maybe too soon and we should not talk ill of the dead before they're buried? We hear that a lot but I don't buy in to that idea. Silencing a national reporter for mentioning the bad parts of someone's legacy doesn't seem to sit right. And it's not like no one at all had mentioned it. The Post itself today has an article that discusses that very subject.

But I also think that reporters, especially ones for high-profile outlets such as the Post, probably have a professional obligation not to put anything out on social media that they wouldn't put out, or be allowed to put out, on the paper's website/paper. She apparently had been admonished by her employers for doing just that previously. The Post stated 'her tweets displayed poor judgment that undermined the work of her colleagues', whatever that means.

So I don't know.

[SciFiFisher]

I heard that she received a lot of support from her co-workers over the suspension and that WAPO lifted the suspension. It's a quandary. We should not ignore the bad a person did but we should also acknowledge the good they did in their life.

[Rommie]

I suspect that if the rape case had happened now instead of over a decade ago, he would have been sidelined by the MeToo movement. I think though most people react viscerally when you think they're "speaking ill of the dead," particularly when it's a tragic, sudden death with the guy's daughter also died along with several others, etc. So while the death is notable, it does seem weird to have such a Reganization, and suspect people wouldn't be so knee jerk to those pointing out his flaws if he died a natural death.

Mind, as a Pittsburgher, I know the same would happen now if Ben Rothlisberger were to die suddenly. It's easier for society to punish those pointing out the bad stuff people have done over facing the fact that we allowed people who did bad things to live lives of privilege and respect.

[geonuc]

Rothlisberger came to mind when I was considering what I thought of Bryant.

[Sigma_Orionis]

I didn't know who this Bryant character was until his death and his daughter's made news everywhere.

[geonuc]

I didn't know who this Bryant character was until his death and his daughter's made news everywhere.

I don't think American basketball translates internationally quite as well as some other sports. By that I mean other than Michael Jordan, maybe not many stars are well known outside our borders. I don't know.

It's also that, despite the virtual canonization of Bryant as a player that's going on now, he wasn't all THAT good. He wasn't a Michael Jordan by any means and I can name at least four other LA Lakers players who were better or more influential in the sport (Chamberlain, Jabbar, Magic, West). He was the third top all-time scorer (now fourth as Lebron James has recently passed him) but how many people can even name the top two? And how many people that can would consider the number two guy (Karl Malone) one of the all time greats? My point is that scoring records don't necessarily correlate perfectly with greatness. Case in point would be Wilt Chamberlain, who was the dominant scorer of his time or any time, yet most basketball fans would rate his contemporary, Bill Russell, as the better player.

I'm rambling. TLDR: Kobe Bryant wasn't Magic Johnson. That's why you hadn't heard of him.

[Rommie]

I didn't know who this Bryant character was until his death and his daughter's made news everywhere.

I don't think American basketball translates internationally quite as well as some other sports. By that I mean other than Michael Jordan, maybe not many stars are well known outside our borders. I don't know.

It's also that, despite the virtual canonization of Bryant as a player that's going on now, he wasn't all THAT good. He wasn't a Michael Jordan by any means and I can name at least four other LA Lakers players who were better or more influential in the sport (Chamberlain, Jabbar, Magic, West). He was the third top all-time scorer (now fourth as Lebron James has recently passed him) but how many people can even name the top two? And how many people that can would consider the number two guy (Karl Malone) one of the all time greats? My point is that scoring records don't necessarily correlate perfectly with greatness. Case in point would be Wilt Chamberlain, who was the dominant scorer of his time or any time, yet most basketball fans would rate his contemporary, Bill Russell, as the better player.

I'm rambling. TLDR: Kobe Bryant wasn't Magic Johnson. That's why you hadn't heard of him.

It seriously depends on the country, and there are a few exceptions (Latin America gets into baseball for example too), but honestly in my experience the NBA is the best known of all the American pro sports abroad. Especially in Asia- people loved the NBA and ask you a ton of questions about it even if they only knew ten words in English, and freak out in excitement when I said I lived in Cleveland and had seen LeBron play. And the NBA wasn't on such pins and needles about players tweeting about Hong Kong protests due to a lack of interest.

But yeah I'm sure that audience knows Yao Ming a lot more than Kobe.

[Sigma_Orionis]

I didn't know who this Bryant character was until his death and his daughter's made news everywhere.

I don't think American basketball translates internationally quite as well as some other sports. By that I mean other than Michael Jordan, maybe not many stars are well known outside our borders. I don't know.

It's also that, despite the virtual canonization of Bryant as a player that's going on now, he wasn't all THAT good. He wasn't a Michael Jordan by any means and I can name at least four other LA Lakers players who were better or more influential in the sport (Chamberlain, Jabbar, Magic, West). He was the third top all-time scorer (now fourth as Lebron James has recently passed him) but how many people can even name the top two? And how many people that can would consider the number two guy (Karl Malone) one of the all time greats? My point is that scoring records don't necessarily correlate perfectly with greatness. Case in point would be Wilt Chamberlain, who was the dominant scorer of his time or any time, yet most basketball fans would rate his contemporary, Bill Russell, as the better player.

I'm rambling. TLDR: Kobe Bryant wasn't Magic Johnson. That's why you hadn't heard of him.

Well, the morning the news came out, some of the guys at the office who are into sports were talking about him. When other people who don't usually follow sports started talking about the guy, I thought he was a rapper or something. Guess I am well past the point where I was awarded the "Get off ma Lawn" certification

[geonuc]

It seriously depends on the country, and there are a few exceptions (Latin America gets into baseball for example too), but honestly in my experience the NBA is the best known of all the American pro sports abroad. Especially in Asia- people loved the NBA and ask you a ton of questions about it even if they only knew ten words in English, and freak out in excitement when I said I lived in Cleveland and had seen LeBron play. And the NBA wasn't on such pins and needles about players tweeting about Hong Kong protests due to a lack of interest.

But yeah I'm sure that audience knows Yao Ming a lot more than Kobe.

OK, you obviously have far more experience with other countries than I, especially recently.

[Thumper]

I'm simply astonished that there is an 8-9 post thread on this board specifically about Kobe Bryant.
Good posts Geo and Rommie. Regarding his sexual abuse charge, the only witness, the young hotel worker refused to testify. Many possible reasons why. The DA could have still filed charges but without much evidence or a complainant, prosecution would have been difficult and particularly ugly, having to treat a young female sexual assault victim as a hostile witness. It's bad enough when the defense badgers a witness, the prosecution would have been in a no win situation. He obviously paid her a considerable sum of money, and his wife was seen with a gigantic new ring immediately after the case was dismissed. So he was lucky he had the means to "pay" for his mistakes and move on. By all accounts he moved on and did good things. I'm with Rommie that if it would have happened in the last couple of years, they'd have buried him. I didn't realize how famous he was world wide especially in China. And was dumbfounded with all the commentary that the NBA should "rethink itself" "consider canceling the season" and all kinds of other overreactions (IMO). I joked with my buddy that morning, "Did they make this big a deal when Martin Luther King was killed?"

[Rommie]

People are really saying that? What on Earth would the NBA do then when Michael Jordan dies?

I did notice the Oscars retrospective of people who died began with a picture of him. I guess he was probably in some Space Jam movie I'm unaware of, but still seemed random.

[Thumper]

The sports talk radio guys were losing their minds. And they were playing clips of current and former NBA players saying all sorts of crazy things like that.

[geonuc]

People are really saying that? What on Earth would the NBA do then when Michael Jordan dies?

I did notice the Oscars retrospective of people who died began with a picture of him. I guess he was probably in some Space Jam movie I'm unaware of, but still seemed random.

He actually won an Academy Award in 2018 for producing a short film.