Election 2020

[code monkey]

… What basis would Trump use to contest and how many states would he have to contest ...

oh fisher, ask a difficult one.

what basis - he lost!
how many - all of them!

he cannot, will not accept a loss.

[lady_*nix]

Yeah and it's not just him. According to this Swedish study at least, the entire Republican party has become far more autocratic during the Trump era.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... tudy-trump

[lady_*nix]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/us-polic ... -election/

These motherfuckers really are going to try and carry out a coup aren't they.

Edit: and more: https://www.wonkette.com/just-mike-pomp ... t-coup-nbd

I see so much confidence from Dems that they can't pull this off but like... They've pulled off almost everything else. Almost every time Dems have been like "They can't do that though!", the Trump administration has gone ahead and Done It. So like do you understand why I'm skeptical about all this being a nothingburger?

[SciFiFisher]

I am not sure when the Biden team will start playing hardball. I am not even sure how it will play out. This administration and Trump have a solid track record of ignoring norms and court orders. But, I suspect the gloves will come off after the Electoral College officially votes. Technically, the EC isn't officially official until January 6th when Congress certifies the tally.

I don't think the court cases are going to get very far. What they are doing though is set up a scenario where the Trump team asks the R team in all the states that voted for Biden to declare the votes as being not valid and assign their own electors to vote on December 15th. It's going to get interesting as hell if they try to pull off the "faithless elector" scenario.

[lady_*nix]

@Fisher

From now to Jan 6 is a very long time as far as what level of fuckery is possible. Not even just legal or traditional coup stuff - a lot of my friends have been pointing out that one of Trump's preferred weapons is stochastic terrorism, and he recently offered to pay all legal fees for a fascist spree shooter. The thing I keep seeing activists saying to watch out for, is a rising wave of militia and terrorist violence in the coming months, backed up with rhetoric from the Presidential pulpit.

That said? I absolutely expect them to try the faithless elector scenario, and I absolutely expect them to have the loyalty to pull it off. It's obviously undemocratic, but they'll justify it as being necessary to restore "proper" democracy or whatever. What other institutions will have to say about that though, IDK.

Edit: also, if it happens and people very predictably riot? We may get to see just how much information flow there is between the NSA and US law enforcement. Such traffic being technically illegal didn't stop it from happening during the Obama admin, and will stop it even less now; as with Trump himself, no accountability and no consequences mean no limits on power.

[lady_*nix]

From literally before Trump even took office:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/postever ... by-design/

The original reasoning for this might have been an attempt at harm reduction, but at the end of the day it's doomed - if not with Trump, then with the next nutcase we get in the Oval Office, or the next. If you give one person the unilateral power to destroy the world, eventually they'll go ahead and do it, because that's literally human nature. "Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely."

[Rommie]

I'm gonna quote an activist astronomer I know, Chanda, on this one:

They want you to panic about a coup, but unless you're doing something with that panic like taking action, they're basically winning and living rent free in your head. They also 100% want you to spread panic.

Mind, her Twitter thread also has actual steps you can take for action, but I do think it's something to keep in mind. I did my due diligence to call but am done being terrorized by idiots at this moment in time.

[lady_*nix]

Thanks, and oh hey you know her? Badass.

Edit: IDK just... I know it's not *helpful* to be freaking out all the time.

(Though honestly I kind of resent the implication that I'm not doing anything useful, like uh hi I've been heavily involved in Boston area activism for the last 3 years? And sure I've had to take a backseat the last few weeks, but that's because my personal life has been exploding and several of my friends have been needing intensive support?)

But like IDK it's hard not to be freaking out right now. Even if Chanda isn't, and has more reason to freak out than I do. You're like "Don't let them live rent-free in your head" and I'm like... how? Their malfeasance can hurt me on pretty much every level of my life. It's cool that your friend who's more marginalized than I am can manage to not freak out, but like... I kind of don't appreciate the implication that this means I'm being hysterical and should sit down? This shit is scary, and the doom feelings are in the air, and it's been four nonstop years of "Trump and his people can't possibly do that!" followed immediately by them Doing It and Democrats being like "We could never have seen that coming!"

[Rommie]

Yeah, we have met a few times and she was def supportive during the tough parts of my PhD. By this point of astro everyone knows everyone on some level.

But yeah it's hard to remember sometimes but a huge part about this talk on their side is only powerful if people buy into it and let them panic others.

Edit: also this sounds reasonable- https://theweek.com/speedreads/949542/t ... ht-theater

[lady_*nix]

@Rommie

Sorry for the lengthy in situ edit, I'm kind of feeling a lot of things right now.

I'm not panicking (yet). I am really alarmed at how unseriously the Democrats seem to be taking this, after four nonstop years of being defeated over and over again by Republican illiberalism and audacity.

Edit: oh cool re your friendship with Chanda! Yeah I've been reading her Twitter semi-frequently for bit, I forget who originally pointed me that way. She seems really cool, also I should start following more science-y people again because that part of my brain has gotten rusty.

[Rommie]

I mean it's free advice, you can take it or leave it. But my personal experience is there's only so much freaking out one can do about the things you can't control until it consumes your life, and that's exactly what they want you to do. Much better to step away when you realize it's happening and devote self care over more doom scrolling is all.

[code monkey]

ok what can we do besides panicking or trying to figure out a way to move to another country (advanced panicking)?

we can remember the senate. there are 2 runoff elections in Georgia which will decide the balance of the senate. so go support the democrats in these races -

jon ossoff
raphael warnick

you can donate to them individually or to fair fight, the organization founded by stacy abrams or to any other organization supporting them.

[SciFiFisher]

I committed to donating a smallish sum every month for the next several months last month. I am also trying to decide if a voodoo doll that looks like the R team candidates and some hairpins might help.

[lady_*nix]

Emily Murphy signed off on the transition. Holy shit. I actually did not expect this, like, ever.

https://twitter.com/mkraju/status/1331011299707408385

[Rommie]

Yeah, I long ago learned that I should just consider Trump to do whatever my brother would have done when we were six, and he was a sore loser. In this case, stamp your feet and shout a lot until the adults just ignore you. There is also a 0% chance that he wrote the Tweet conceding that the transition can go forward, IMO, also on those grounds.

I confess though it does make me wonder how this will play out in terms of Georgia. I guarantee the two Republicans there would love nothing more than Trump to go do some rallies on their behalf and get people out. On the one hand, the dude does love to win, and this would put a great big middle finger to the Dems if they pull it off. On the other, dude lost not just the election but Georgia, and he doesn't stand to gain much right now from helping out those two Senators (vs the allure of just heading down to Mar a Lago and chilling). In some universes, I think a Senate that's Dem controlled helps Trump with any future 2024 aspirations- more to bitch about!

Well that and also on a more practical level, we are now going from the "sore loser" stage of the election to the "who can I pardon" stage of transition, and I'm pretty sure trying to pardon yourself and all of your family members is gonna be a wee bit more time consuming than Georgia runoffs. And dude has a lot more to stand to gain personally if he can pull those off over winning the Senate.

[SciFiFisher]

Yeah, I long ago learned that I should just consider Trump to do whatever my brother would have done when we were six, and he was a sore loser. In this case, stamp your feet and shout a lot until the adults just ignore you. There is also a 0% chance that he wrote the Tweet conceding that the transition can go forward, IMO, also on those grounds.

I confess though it does make me wonder how this will play out in terms of Georgia. I guarantee the two Republicans there would love nothing more than Trump to go do some rallies on their behalf and get people out. On the one hand, the dude does love to win, and this would put a great big middle finger to the Dems if they pull it off. On the other, dude lost not just the election but Georgia, and he doesn't stand to gain much right now from helping out those two Senators (vs the allure of just heading down to Mar a Lago and chilling). In some universes, I think a Senate that's Dem controlled helps Trump with any future 2024 aspirations- more to bitch about!

Well that and also on a more practical level, we are now going from the "sore loser" stage of the election to the "who can I pardon" stage of transition, and I'm pretty sure trying to pardon yourself and all of your family members is gonna be a wee bit more time consuming than Georgia runoffs. And dude has a lot more to stand to gain personally if he can pull those off over winning the Senate.

Trump Logic: Will Helping Those Losers in Georgia Do Anything For Me? If the answer is no then they are not going to be seeing Trump. And since there is nothing they can do for him...

[lady_*nix]

Yeah I'm just gonna put this here:

https://twitter.com/gpbnews/status/1333886597264240640

"It has all gone too far," Georgia election official @GabrielSterling said while addressing threats against election workers.

"Mr. President, you have not condemned this language or these actions. Senators, you have not condemned this language or these actions." #gapol https://t.co/AF86Iy1RJT

[code monkey]

Yeah I'm just gonna put this here:

https://twitter.com/gpbnews/status/1333886597264240640

"It has all gone too far," Georgia election official @GabrielSterling said while addressing threats against election workers.

"Mr. President, you have not condemned this language or these actions. Senators, you have not condemned this language or these actions." #gapol https://t.co/AF86Iy1RJT

even better - see a film of him. about time.

[lady_*nix]

https://twitter.com/jacobsoboroff/statu ... 3248653312

BREAKING: Lawyers say Trump admin has handed over new data that will help reunite separated migrant families.

"Not only have they not been helping but they have been withholding this data forever," @ACLU
's @leegelernt
told @NBCNews

The Biden Administration needs to prosecute this shit. They probably won't... but they need to.

[code monkey]

The Biden Administration needs to prosecute this shit. They probably won't... but they need to.

please. if you think that our current president will not leave office with a ford-Nixon pardon from himself and, perhaps, one from pence as well (suspenders and belt, you know) I beg you to think again. if he's feeling especially generous, everyone in his administration will also be protected. so forget prosecution.

however, think investigation. once one has been pardoned, one can no longer take the 5th - there's no penalty. so I say investigate.

btw, did you happen to see katie porter questioning steve mnuchin? after he said that he was not a lawyer, he asked her, dripping with sarcasm, if she were a lawyer!

[lady_*nix]

@cm

It's also the elite impunity thing. They're chicken to investigate and prosecute the Trump regime's crimes because they've partaken in such corruption and abuse of power themselves, and actually holding people accountable this time sets a precedent that could get them in trouble later. The mechanisms that allow Trump to keep being "Teflon Don" are the same ones that allowed GW Bush to get away with torture, war crimes, and more than 500,000 civilian deaths in Iraq; allowed Bill Clinton to abuse numerous women, sell a pardon to a white-collar criminal, and fly on Jeffrey Epstein's pedo-plane without repercussions; etc.

The ruling class are basically a bunch of creeps, perverts, and sociopaths; Trump might be gauche and uncouth but he's still one of them, so their asses are on the line too if they let him face consequences.

(Sorry in advance for any typos in the above BTW, I am getting maaaaaadddd brain fog today LOL.)

[SciFiFisher]

In a perverse twist Trump allies are holding rallies and telling the base not to vote in the January election because the November one was rigged. Also, because the two idiots running (Loefler and Perdue) were not willing to demand the Governor intervene and stop the Republcian election officials from certifying the election in favor of Biden.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/pol ... 800126001/

[code monkey]

In a perverse twist Trump allies are holding rallies and telling the base not to vote in the January election because the November one was rigged. Also, because the two idiots running (Loefler and Perdue) were not willing to demand the Governor intervene and stop the Republcian election officials from certifying the election in favor of Biden.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/pol ... 800126001/

gosh, fisher. you say that as though it's a bad thing.

[lady_*nix]

Guess he's trying to take his party down with him instead of the world? For now? I hope?

[Rommie]

I confess I'll believe it when I see it if the Republicans say they're not going to vote. I'm sure they'll talk the talk but show up anyway- you think that giant crowd in Georgia at the rally this weekend wasn't going to vote?! (Well, the ones not too sick with covid, I guess...)

That said, I suppose the trick is turnout is always harder in not a general election, and especially in a special election, and this will be so close any little factor can be the tipping point. Though from what my friends in Georgia tell me, you really would have a hard time not knowing about the special election with all the calls and texts!

I'm also kind of fascinated by how some speculate the Dems might win one election, and Republicans the other. Who's actually going to vote split ticket when the stakes are so high on Democrats getting both?! Then I remember it's probably a fraction of one percent of all voters who'd do it... and that's probably enough to sway this election either way.