Coronavirus

[SciFiFisher]

So, yeah. Just as we start seeing some light at the end of the tunnel covid decided to mutate and become easier to catch. It seems that the vaccines for the first version are various levels of effectiveness against the new version(s).

My read on the tea leaves is that since we have a fair bit of practice tweaking vaccines for mutating virus sets i.e. the annual flu vaccines and a really decent set of vaccines for the first variant of covid we just might be able to sucker punch the new versions. But, first, we have to catch up with the original covid.

And thank god we have a new administration that really wants to do something about the virus.

[Rommie]

I feel like we are in a weird period in this pandemic where we are in the end game, and people are really having a hard time in discussions differentiating between "things that might happen" and "things that will happen."

Like, I think you're an idiot if you think things are going to be back to normal by summer. Will things be waaaaay more normal though? That seems pretty darn likely, honestly! Like, just because I can't go to a giant mosh pit in July with thousands of people or a giant indoor concert just yet doesn't mean it's not going to be awesome to meet up with other vaccinated friends on a nice pub patio, even if you have to wear a mask to/from there on public transit or in the Uber. Things are looking great that my husband and I will be able to go to Europe to safely see his family after over a year without seeing them- stuff like that. And during our Valentine's Day dinner (takeout from a fancy place with a special menu, F set up a very chic special "restaurant" in the living room) we discussed the wedding we had rescheduled for August and how we expect to be able to do it in some form- maybe not with an international crowd and just fellow vaccinated locals, but everyone's going to have too much fun to care I think. (We're also just not going to have a fancy wedding party thing at all if it gets pushed forward again, I'll bet, because it's been two years since we tied the legal knot.)

Mention this last one in particular to some people, and wow do they actively shit on your tiny bit of optimism that you might be able to have a wedding. Like yes Carol, if it does not appear safe in August to have a wedding of course we are not going to have one, because we are not assholes. But why do you feel such an urge to actively shit all over someone showing the slightest bit of hope that things might be going for the better? Habit, or this is just an elaborate way of saying you don't want an invite?

Hope this message makes sense, it's not directed to anyone specifically, just an undercurrent I've noticed and it's weird to have conversations about because the assumption immediately seems to be you don't care if you try to hope things won't be so bad sooner over later. Or maybe we're all just sick to death of February, who knows.

[lady_*nix]

So, uh. Anyone else seen today's XKCD re the vaccine?

https://xkcd.com/2425/

[Rommie]

Honestly, probably the best explanation of how they work I've seen!

Also, of course hat guy is an anti-masker.

[lady_*nix]

Had to mail a bunch of backlog stuff to my ex roomie, now in Seattle... and now I have to do intra-house lockdown again, masks and distancing and all, because after a year of this hell and 500,000 deaths in the US alone people are *still* being fucking idiots about wearing masks indoors. One old lady inside the post office didn't even bring a mask, and a post office employee was nose peeping the whole time (around other employees!) until I told him his mask was slipping. (And from how long the thing was under his nose, I'm pretty sure it wasn't and he was doing that deliberately.)

So... yay. Already dealing with heavy emotional shit, and now two more weeks of further isolation from current roomies, because too many people still can't be arsed to do that most minimal, simple measure of wearing a fucking mask inside buildings.

Why they gotta be so fucking stupid. WHY.

Edit: I know this probably sounds like extreme measures BTW, but I and at least one of my roomies are probably super high risk for our age group, and the newer variants spread more effectively through aerosols and stuff and have a longer gestation period. Plus I was kind of an idiot myself and forgot my glasses, so no eye protection from droplets.

[pumpkinpi]

Had to mail a bunch of backlog stuff to my ex roomie, now in Seattle... and now I have to do intra-house lockdown again, masks and distancing and all, because after a year of this hell and 500,000 deaths in the US alone people are *still* being fucking idiots about wearing masks indoors. One old lady inside the post office didn't even bring a mask, and a post office employee was nose peeping the whole time (around other employees!) until I told him his mask was slipping. (And from how long the thing was under his nose, I'm pretty sure it wasn't and he was doing that deliberately.)

So... yay. Already dealing with heavy emotional shit, and now two more weeks of further isolation from current roomies, because too many people still can't be arsed to do that most minimal, simple measure of wearing a fucking mask inside buildings.

Why they gotta be so fucking stupid. WHY.

Edit: I know this probably sounds like extreme measures BTW, but I and at least one of my roomies are probably super high risk for our age group, and the newer variants spread more effectively through aerosols and stuff and have a longer gestation period. Plus I was kind of an idiot myself and forgot my glasses, so no eye protection from droplets.

Ugh, that really sucks.
I was coming here for a similar but different rant. I've got people on my facebook feed posting their vacation pictures to Florida and other warm places. I mean yeah, it's been a long tough winter and it would be nice to get away and relax. But really, can't it wait? I mean I agonized about whether I should travel to see my dying mom, decided to do so, and when I got there I was outside the whole time except for the car and hotel. I didn't even go into my sister's or my parents' house. And I felt damn guilty for traveling. People, tough it out for a little longer, please.

[Rommie]

"But it's so cheap!!!"

My sister is excited because her MIL will be fully vaccinated with the booster+ waiting period by Easter, so will be coming to visit them then. That is, IMO, perfectly acceptable, particularly when you have two small kids and your husband will be recovering from a surgery. Meanwhile, my mom keeps asking us when we are going to visit them, and gets all upset when we say we aren't going to until she's vaccinated too, because "I'm not afraid of you!" Kinda missing the point, mom...

[lady_*nix]

I really have to ask what's wrong with some people, that slowly choking to death all alone, hundreds of miles from anything familiar (and probably in a tourist trap with limited medical care facilities), seems in any way like a worthwhile risk. Like, I probably could imagine a realistic death scenario that scares me more, but I'd have to work pretty hard at it.

[Rommie]

Well, my mom legit told me at the beginning of all this that once you're older you don't really have much left to live for, and it's not the same as dying when you're young, and we all have to die of something/ most people actually die alone. I'm pretty sure this is all from a healthy dose of Eastern European fatalism.

[lady_*nix]

I... guess? But personally if I were going to die soon, I'd rather it be with my pain well managed, at home, and surrounded by people who love me. Or failing that, so fast and painless I didn't know what hit me. Not, you know, terrified and struggling to breathe until the very end. [Edited to add: especially that last as someone who gets asthma attacks, I mean Jesus Christ, 1/100th of what severe COVID patients feel is already plenty for me.]

In case it's not obvious, I've been thinking about my death rather a lot over the last year or so... actually, quite a bit longer than that.

But anyway if nothing else, I'd hope one might prefer to die in a way they didn't risk transmitting to other people, many of them younger and with more will to live.

[SciFiFisher]

As hard as it is to believe a lot of people seem to be oblivious to their own mortality. Sure there is a world wide pandemic. Yes, over 500,000 people in the U.S. have died. But, it won't happen to ME. I live a magically charmed life. I am ten feet tall and bullet proof. Bad things don't happen to someone just because they wanted to go on vacation man. Etc etc etc.

Look at the news stories. How many of them have featured some schmuck who denied COVID was real who just before they died said "Well damn! I guess it is real. Please tell everyone they should take this seriously now!" I want to reach through my computer monitor, phone, TV and grab them by the throat and shake them until they get it. And then I realize they are already dead.

The point is that their dying words would not have to be "tell people to take this seriously" if they had taken it seriously. If they had taken it seriously we wouldn't have over 500,000 deaths. If they tried to pretend just a little bit that they really had some common sense we could have saved over 250,000 people.

Anyhoo...my point is that they are too self absorbed or seriously drain bamaged to realize they are the at least part of the reason we are in this pickle.

[lady_*nix]

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-n ... xperts-say

Looks like the anecdata was correct - droplet infection through the eyes is a high risk, transmission from surfaces much less so. Don't stop washing your hands though, y'all.

[Rommie]

I mean, pretty sure most people had terrible hand hygiene to begin with, so if this is what teaches them otherwise so be it.

But yeah, a lot of the cleaning stuff definitely looked a bit like security theater to me by the fall. I suspect people want it to look like you're in a controlled and safe environment, so if they can show efforts in one thing it probably is a reasonable business decision? Only so much people can do to attract customers these days I guess, especially when in a restaurant where magically the virus doesn't spread when people take their masks off at the table.

[code monkey]

…

Mention this last one in particular to some people, and wow do they actively shit on your tiny bit of optimism that you might be able to have a wedding. Like yes Carol, if it does not appear safe in August to have a wedding of course we are not going to have one, because we are not assholes. But why do you feel such an urge to actively shit all over someone showing the slightest bit of hope that things might be going for the better? Habit, or this is just an elaborate way of saying you don't want an invite?

Hope this message makes sense, it's not directed to anyone specifically, just an undercurrent I've noticed and it's weird to have conversations about because the assumption immediately seems to be you don't care if you try to hope things won't be so bad sooner over later. Or maybe we're all just sick to death of February, who knows.

why? because some people just aren't happy unless they're bringing a little gloom and doom into the lives of others. maybe I makes the feel superior. maybe it's envy. all 3? they're not mutually exclusive.

yes, it makes sense and you're not the only one who's seen this. once again, people enjoying gloom and doom? that feeling of superiority? tired of winter?

[SciFiFisher]

While there are still lots or reasons to be sad and depressed there was a huge announcement yesterday. The Biden administration has brokered an arrangement between Merck and Johnson & Johnson to ramp up production of the J & J vaccine. This and other actions they have taken will allow there to be enough vaccine for every adult in the U.S. by the end of May.

Please ignore Texas and Mississippi they are run by schmucks.

[Rommie]

Yeah, though the cynic will note that enough vaccine doesn't mean "distributed."

I also think the Merck thing will be super useful maybe not even for this current push, but in the future the J&J vaccine is being tested on currently excluded populations like infants. How awesome would it be if all kids could just get it much faster than us, germ bombs that they are?

The interesting one in Massachusetts was currently teachers did not qualify for the vaccine, but the governor kept insisting that in-person schooling must resume this spring (how MA got a Republican I'm still not quite sure), which is quite an ask when you're also opening restaurants and theaters more now. Everyone was really upset, and thankfully because Biden just said all CVS locations will be able to vaccinate teachers, Baker had to blink and allow teachers to get on the list of those currently approved. That wasn't so hard now, was it?

Well anyway, it's shaping up to be a great summer!

[SciFiFisher]

Yes, that is one factor that has implications. We will have enough vaccine to immunize every adult in the U.S. by May or early June at the latest. But we know that not every adult will get vaccinated. The ones who can't such as those who might allergic or have other medical reasons. Then there are the idiots. After watching the last few years we have some appreciation of how many idiots there are in this country. I wonder if the lower ranking R team members are noticing that the Elites on their team are shoving people out of line to get their vaccine?

The good news is that in spite of the Anti-vaxxers and the other idiots there should be enough people who do get the vaccine to create a sizable herd immunity.
They are predicting that if all goes well we should have enough people vaccinated or immune for various reasons by summer.

[pumpkinpi]

When does vaccinating kids come into the picture? Is your statement about enough people vaccinated/immune by summer take that into account? If enough adults/older kids are vaccinated, will it not be as much of a problem if they arent?

[Rommie]

Kids 16 and over are approved for one of them (I think Pfeizer?) so at least there's that. But still, I guess it'd be a lot easier to reach those herd immunity numbers if all kids could get vaccinated, but that won't begin until autumn at least.

I know a certain percentage of people won't get vaccinated any more than some people never get vaccinated for other things, but I'm hoping the tide will turn. I definitely know a lot of people who were hesitant when it was first approved, but seem more willing now that a few months have passed and they see people aren't dropping dead in the street after getting it. And I imagine that number will grow even more once, say, people realize you aren't going to be able to get on a plane or a cruise without proving you're vaccinated.

Well anyway it sounds like per the CDC guidelines today I'm going to be wearing my mask the next time I fly in a plane, for example. I confess I don't get people still super upset about this- FFS you had a year to get used to it, and I highly doubt you'll still have to do it a year from now, so why is it so upsetting to have to wear one? I guess I'm just tired of the same people shouting the same thing.

[pumpkinpi]

Argh. I continue to see people whom I think are sensible traveling for spring break. I really want to call them out. They may think that *they* are traveling safely. But it's not just about the precautions they take, it's also about the number of people who may or may not be taking those precautions. This virus loves having lots of people around.

YOU CAN WAIT TO SEE YOUR LOVED ONES! JUST A FEW MONTHS PLEASE!!!!!

[Rommie]

It's interesting, I feel like the last week-ish is the first time I'm starting to really see people I know getting vaccines. A lot are definitely older folks thanks to dropping age restrictions, and I imagine several are due to health issues I don't know about, and some are also just because of the hodge-podge of state vaccination eligibility. Like, everyone I know in Arizona in academia got their jab weeks ago, even if they're just researchers in the lab, because all universities qualify. Same with many in California- apparently Caltech/JPL is telling all their staff they qualify as educators even if they aren't actually teaching in any way?

I mean, I notice these are all states where higher education doesn't dominate anything, so ok- that's definitely not the case here. But I suppose one is inevitably a little jealous!

Also awesome, dad got his second jab Tuesday. Says he felt feverish a little yesterday, but felt fine after an Advil, so that's awesome.

[lady_*nix]

Yeah same here. I think part of it is that moderate to severe asthma now qualifies; but also that we're starting to see the effects of vaccine production being ramped up, and the federal executive branch actually believing in things like civic duty again. Remember, the Trump administration wasn't just failing to do useful things re production and distribution, they were actively interfering with the distribution of medical stuff to blue states. (And in most red states the logistics were never going to be good anyway.)

Now, with admittedly shitty but even vaguely responsible people in federal office, we have "wartime" measures to boost vaccine production, and the military doing mass vaccinations in red states. Competence on the federal level matters much more than a lot of people realize, and I say that as a die-hard socialist who fucking hates Biden and his Bill Clinton worshipping cronies.

[code monkey]

Well, my mom legit told me at the beginning of all this that once you're older you don't really have much left to live for, and it's not the same as dying when you're young, and we all have to die of something/ most people actually die alone. I'm pretty sure this is all from a healthy dose of Eastern European fatalism.

and that brought back a memory. I've, once again, urged my parents to take some steps towards healthier living. one of them (why can't I remember which?) says, 'we're on the downhill side of life' and I practically shout back, 'you don't have to grease the slide!'

[lady_*nix]

So here's a good point - we don't actually know that the available vaccines prevent long COVID, only that they prevent hospitalization and death. Especially in the case of new strains where the vaccines will keep it from killing you, but won't keep you from getting sick.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... th-answers

So we should probably all continue being careful after being vaccinated. Especially as without the vaccine, the rate of long COVID from even mild cases may be 30%.

[Rommie]

My mom got the Johnson and Johnson shot yesterday! What a great feeling!

As an aside, I had a friend in Amsterdam who was surprised to hear she already got it- didn't realize but his partner was on the J&J development team. So it was really great to thank someone personally who made it happen!